Psiberzerker's Build Clinic

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Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
Psiberzerker, this game is much easier to understand with your help. My Nord Ranger (?) is going along great, thanks to your guidance. While she is only level 20, I have experienced far more than previous characters. She was able to complete Break of Dawn, and the sword I got is amazing. She can even kill dragons by swinging her sword, instead of spells. I am also farther than I have been before as well. Thanks! :beermug:
 

Nighthiker77

Well-Known Member
My SKSE/SKYUI/1.9 is all messed up(didn't upgrade on purpose) and I really don't feel like breaking any quests. I just got Mehrunes Razor so I was thinking about Legendary resetting my conjuration and going for windshear to dual wield with it. I'm in the 80s sneak/illusion /archery so I shouldn't have any trouble staying alive without conjuration perked. My magica is 320 naked and I have some conjuration cost reduction gear and +magica gear, so I could almost play exactly the same. I am assuming I'll still have all my spells. This is my no-crafting build, killing it at level 35 on adept.

Will the reset force me up to legendary difficulty? Any other surprise snags I haven't anticipated? I know this build could hang easy on expert, might be strong enough for master, but not so sure about legendary.
 

Nighthiker77

Well-Known Member
To rephrase, I think conjuration is still viable at level 15 no perks if you already have your spells and 300+ magica. Do you agree?

I know it would make more sense strategically to just level another skill so I'd have 2 high skills I could use, but i don't enjoy leveling skills I don't like. I figure this way, I can just organically level what I use and shift my play style a little instead of monotonous grinding for more perks. Conjuration seems to be the fastest leveling skill I've ever used.
 
To rephrase, I think conjuration is still viable at level 15 no perks if you already have your spells and 300+ magica. Do you agree?

I know it would make more sense strategically to just level another skill so I'd have 2 high skills I could use, but i don't enjoy leveling skills I don't like. I figure this way, I can just organically level what I use and shift my play style a little instead of monotonous grinding for more perks. Conjuration seems to be the fastest leveling skill I've ever used.
The great thing about Conjuration is that pretty much all the spells have long enough durations for your Magicka recover. So, if you can cast it in the first place, you don't really need any more magical assistance. What kind of skill/perk spread do you have? Lockpicking, and Speech are the quickest to grind up just for some quick levels, and pretty much pay for themselves. Both work well enough without perks so you can spend the points on other perk intensive skills.
 
If I were to eliminate Destruction, so I don't level up so freaking fast, and put the points into Conj & 1H, that would still work, right? I ask because last time Dest leveled me up so fast that I was in over my head.
Destruction doesn't make you level all that fast, unless you grind it. What it does is cap out low, so as you level, it becomes less effective. Conjuration can level you much faster, which isn't a bad thing, especially if you spend the points on something else, like your Weapon skills.
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
Destruction doesn't make you level all that fast, unless you grind it. What it does is cap out low, so as you level, it becomes less effective. Conjuration can level you much faster, which isn't a bad thing, especially if you spend the points on something else, like your Weapon skills.

Yeah, I used Destruction as my primary weapon, and was outgunned, underprotected, and got my butt handed back to me in pieces too many times. When I needed magic, and Destruction wasn't working for me, I didn't know what to do.

I was going to focus on Archery, 1H, conj, LA, sneak, alt, & illus. Archery, 1H & LA for protection in the beginning, Sneak to avoid getting pounded on. Conj, Alt & Illusion to be my weapons & armor when I had the spells & levels. I was thinking Archery to get ready for Bound Bow, & to be able to sneak more to avoid contact, Conj for bound weapons & soul stealer early, Summoner & Atromancy later, Alt for Magic resistance & oak/stone/iron/ebony flesh, 1H for Bound Sword & back up when Magicka is low, LA for the same reason +Windwalker cannot hurt, Sneak to get Assassin's Blade & Deadly Aim, & Illusion primarily to get to Invisible.
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
Psiberzerker, I would put my level points into magicka primarily, so maybe I should look at HA until I have the spells to protect me?
 
Psiberzerker, I would put my level points into magicka primarily, so maybe I should look at HA until I have the spells to protect me?
If you go Altmer, you don't have to invest as much in Magicka, so put it on Health instead. Get Flaming Familiar, that should replace most of what you'd need Destruction for, and use the Durations to recover your Magicka.
I was going to focus on Archery, 1H, conj, LA, sneak, alt, & illus. Archery, 1H & LA for protection in the beginning, Sneak to avoid getting pounded on. Conj, Alt & Illusion to be my weapons & armor when I had the spells & levels. I was thinking Archery to get ready for Bound Bow, & to be able to sneak more to avoid contact, Conj for bound weapons & soul stealer early, Summoner & Atromancy later, Alt for Magic resistance & oak/stone/iron/ebony flesh, 1H for Bound Sword & back up when Magicka is low, LA for the same reason +Windwalker cannot hurt, Sneak to get Assassin's Blade & Deadly Aim, & Illusion primarily to get to Invisible.
Fast leveling is mostly a factor of how many skills you use, and how often. That's a bunch, but you'll have more Stat/Perk points to spread around for it. The core skills are Weapons (Archery/1H) Conjuration, possibly an Armor, Sneak, or Alteration to prevent damage, but here's where you can do some weeding out.

You can go Heavy Armor/Robes to take advantage of some of the Unique Items available, but only be able to Sneak within Range. Full Light Armor leaves you with natural Magicka Regeneration, which means not being able to juggle spells as effectively early on. You might want to add Enchanting rather than wait around for good magical Light Armor from random loot. Unarmored is doable with Alteration, and/or Block. Bound Sword pretty much leaves you with Power Attack Stagger defensively, but works well with Critical Charge to nail down the tough targets. Otherwise, it's mostly a damage dealer. En passant Spellsword tactics with tanking summons, and/or Flaming Familiar.

Bound Bow, and Dremora Lord. Any fight you can't win with just that might require the addition of a good Follower. Storm Atronach/s for Dragons, pretty exceptional in the Endgame. If you're thinking more Nightbladey/Arcane Assassin than Spellsword/Battlemage, then Sneak, Light Armor, Robes of Illusion, and a good Dagger. http://skyrimcalculator.com/#278037
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
If you go Altmer, you don't have to invest as much in Magicka, so put it on Health instead. Get Flaming Familiar, that should replace most of what you'd need Destruction for, and use the Durations to recover your Magicka.

Fast leveling is mostly a factor of how many skills you use, and how often. That's a bunch, but you'll have more Stat/Perk points to spread around for it. The core skills are Weapons (Archery/1H) Conjuration, possibly an Armor, Sneak, or Alteration to prevent damage, but here's where you can do some weeding out.

You can go Heavy Armor/Robes to take advantage of some of the Unique Items available, but only be able to Sneak within Range. Full Light Armor leaves you with natural Magicka Regeneration, which means not being able to juggle spells as effectively early on. You might want to add Enchanting rather than wait around for good magical Light Armor from random loot. Unarmored is doable with Alteration, and/or Block. Bound Sword pretty much leaves you with Power Attack Stagger defensively, but works well with Critical Charge to nail down the tough targets. Otherwise, it's mostly a damage dealer. En passant Spellsword tactics with tanking summons, and/or Flaming Familiar.

Bound Bow, and Dremora Lord. Any fight you can't win with just that might require the addition of a good Follower. Storm Atronach/s for Dragons, pretty exceptional in the Endgame. If you're thinking more Nightbladey/Arcane Assassin than Spellsword/Battlemage, then Sneak, Light Armor, Robes of Illusion, and a good Dagger. http://skyrimcalculator.com/#278037


So, HA instead of LA, & add enchanting instead of alteration?

No, Spellsword/Battlemage sounds better.
 

Nighthiker77

Well-Known Member
Game changer, can't believe I've never tried this before, but i found some random loot Ebony Boots of Muffling, gave them to my heavy 2h follower, and now I can drag her around without getting detected. I found them in that corner place at Labyrinthian with the 2 deathlords. The only thing that gets me is when I sheath bound bow and she sheaths and re-draws, it seems like they hear it sometimes. Are the Initiates already muffled?
 
So, HA instead of LA, & add enchanting instead of alteration?

No, Spellsword/Battlemage sounds better.
In that cast, yeah. Alteration makes up for not wearing a Body, and you can even carry around a lightweight one (Wolf) in case you really feel the need to tank up. Might be a good idea to layer it when you're delving deep into a crypt where you won't be able to use your Bow much. Just drop Sneak/Illusion, unless you want to play with Fear/Rage/Calm up to Invisibility. Splash in just Stealth(1), Backstab, and Deadly Aim for snipe shots. Running around the wilderness, I keep out Bound Sword, and juggle Detect Life with an Armor spell to keep it up. Once you get Quiet Casting, your life gets a lot easier.

That's what your summons are, help while you defend yourself with other skills. You can drop a tank, and support them with Bound Arrows, alternate waves of Flaming Familiar with Power Attacks to Stagger (Spellsword style) and probably get a Follower to give you even more options. At that point, I'd say the most versatile the better, so Belrand, Eola, or Jenassa. You can conjure tanks, so any of those would be redundant. If you do get Windshear, give it to any of them, and look for a battle large enough to actually need all that.

Eventually, you might be able to pull off Shadowsummuner, which is just Invisibility, Frensy, and Dremora Lords/Flaming Familiar. With Twin Souls, and Quiet Casting, you can get them fighting each other, send in a Dremora Lord, then Flaming Familiar with Invisibility after each cast to recover completely out of the action. At that point, Sneak, and Armor are moot, so you can even do it without Equipment. Unfortunately, these tactics only really work effectively in large fights with a lot of enemies that are susceptible to Illusion.
 
Game changer, can't believe I've never tried this before, but i found some random loot Ebony Boots of Muffling, gave them to my heavy 2h follower, and now I can drag her around without getting detected. I found them in that corner place at Labyrinthian with the 2 deathlords. The only thing that gets me is when I sheath bound bow and she sheaths and re-draws, it seems like they hear it sometimes. Are the Initiates already muffled?
You can also do that trick with the Ebony Mail. Love slapping that on my Tank, and creeping forward for a Backstab...
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
I think I will wear LA while I level up Alt with points. I figure between Alt & Conj, I should be fine. LA will allow me to be quieter when sneaking around until I feel more comfortable wearing robes & casting spells. So, I am looking at, for level points: Archery, 1H, Sneak, Illusion, Conjuration & Alteration, with points being dumped into Health & Magicka at a rate of 2 to 1, so, at level 6 I will have put points 4 times on Health, and 2 times into Magicka. I won't need to carry much, except for loot, so I think this will work.....

Psiberzerker, what are your thoughts???
 
I think I will wear LA while I level up Alt with points. I figure between Alt & Conj, I should be fine. LA will allow me to be quieter when sneaking around until I feel more comfortable wearing robes & casting spells. So, I am looking at, for level points: Archery, 1H, Sneak, Illusion, Conjuration & Alteration, with points being dumped into Health & Magicka at a rate of 2 to 1, so, at level 6 I will have put points 4 times on Health, and 2 times into Magicka. I won't need to carry much, except for loot, so I think this will work.....

Psiberzerker, what are your thoughts???
I don't do rigid proportions for stat points, but with Magic users, you want enough Magicka to cast your spells. Especially with this type of build where Durations last long enough for your Magicka to recover. Any more than that, and you leave a little blue in your gauge which could be on the end of your Health bar, so you'll last longer. So, at first you want to be able to cast Bound Bow, then invest in Magicka when you're about to add higher level (and Casting Cost) spells, otherwise put most of it in Health by default. Light Armor is nice for magicka free protection, but then you should be able to simulcast Oakflesh with Bound Sword (As soon as you have the Novice Perks) before closing in to mop up.

Light Armor doesn't help you Sneak, it just doesn't have as much of a Noise Penalty as Heavy. Unarmored has none at all, and especially in the Boots, because the weight of your footwear is a primary Variable in the detection calculation (Meaning it's quantified before the Multipliers, and you're going for a low number.) So, whatever you chose for defence, the piece of Armor you can do best without is the boots. They don't add much protection, and they do noticably increase your odds of being detected. One way they actually do help you Sneak is with Enchantments, like Muffle (On the Shrouded, and Nightingale Boots, or Ebony Mail.)

With enough Health, and proper battle Tactics, I don't need Armor (Including Spells) at all. You'll never have enough to Tank, but this isn't that kind of Fighter, either. You just need enough to soak the occasional lucky Arrow, and stay out of the Melee for extended periods where the heavy Damage is. That's the beauty of Alteration, you can use it early on for better protection while investing in Magicka, then when you have enough health, you can save your magicka, and use your Evasion. However, your Alteration grinds up high enough to unlock the Magic Resistance, and possibly Spell Absorbtion (If you aren't summoning) perks to protect against Magic.

My point is, take stats level by level, rather than setting up a schedule like 2 health, then 1 Magicka, or whatever. If you're like pretty much any other player, you sit in the Skill menu, and surf through the constellations every level trying to figure out where this point will do you the most good. Take your time to do the same with your Stat Points, think back to since the last Level. Done a lot of Dying lately, or running away to Heal? It might be nice to have more Health. You can simulcast Bound bow, and Oakflesh, but not Stoneflesh? It time to build up some more Magicka. Keep in mind, you can wear more stat points too, if you know where to look. For instance, the Gauldur Amulet often makes the difference until I build up 3 more levels of Magicka, and then there's Savos' Amulet later in the College arc.

I usually have a Default Stat, though. If nothing else jumps right out, and say "Ooh ooh, pick me!" then put it in Health, but rather than just clicking it on reflex, remember to get some Magicka whenever you have found yourself tapping out, and having to recover. Look for higher grade Hoods, or Fortify School enchantments, and you won't need as much Magicka. I'd actually sacrifice armor, unless you need it, and be ready to replace your Robes when it looks like you're walking into a moshpit. For example, you can wear Light Armor, except Robes of Alteration, cast Ebonyflesh (And Bound Sword) then swap into Elven Armor for maximum protection in the fray...
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
You can go Heavy Armor/Robes to take advantage of some of the Unique Items available, but only be able to Sneak within Range. Full Light Armor leaves you with natural Magicka Regeneration, which means not being able to juggle spells as effectively early on. You might want to add Enchanting rather than wait around for good magical Light Armor from random loot. Unarmored is doable with Alteration, and/or Block. Bound Sword pretty much leaves you with Power Attack Stagger defensively, but works well with Critical Charge to nail down the tough targets. Otherwise, it's mostly a damage dealer. En passant Spellsword tactics with tanking summons, and/or Flaming Familiar.

So, if I am reading this correctly, HA is a better choice for the spellcaster in the beginning...... Enchanting the HA is a better choice than hoping for Magical LA, never pass on good robes, and leather boots make you quieter....
 

Nighthiker77

Well-Known Member
You can get 4 or 5 different muffled pieces of footwear in the Dark Brotherhood questline. Shrouded&ancient shrouded boots are light armor , Cicero's shoes and shrouded shoes/footwraps are clothing.

2 of them you can get less than an hour out of Helgen. I was excited because I've never found muffled heavy boots before.
 

Joker

Cook, Wine Taster, Scotch Taster, Adventure Seeker
You can get 4 or 5 different muffled pieces of footwear in the Dark Brotherhood questline. Shrouded&ancient shrouded boots are light armor , Cicero's shoes and shrouded shoes/footwraps are clothing.

2 of them you can get less than an hour out of Helgen. I was excited because I've never found muffled heavy boots before.


An hour in game play, travel, or.....? I ask because I haven't completed the game yet.
 

Nighthiker77

Well-Known Member
If you went straight for it and already knew what to do, you could probably join the Dark Brotherhood in about 20 minutes after clearing Helgen if you used the carriages. Maybe an hour of game play if you stopped in Riverwood and Whiterun to chitchat.

If you haven't done that questline yet, it is my favorite by far. You can pick it up in Windhelm or Riften by just talking to people. It is loaded with good gear too, even if you are smithing and enchanting, especially good for how early you can get it.
 
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