Are housecarls, especially Lydia, the best tanks in skyrim?

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Are housecarls the BEST warrior/tank followers?


  • Total voters
    31
So basically, I got into an argument with someone on the forum about followers. This person argued that Lydia, along with all housecarls were the best follower combatants in the game, and could single handedly kill anything, including groups of giants and mammoths single handedly.

Knowing about how Lydia died on me in at the hand of a restless draugr at level 7, I questioned this, and posed my speculations. I argued that mjoll the lioness, vilkas, and many others made better followers. She then , for lack of a better word, public ally b*tched at me and forced me to pull out of the conversation.

I have made this thread to prove to this person that housecarls aren't the best, and generally suck.

Make your vote, so I may end this argument with her at last.

Dagmar, you aren't allowed to vote, as neither am I.
 

Thallik the Orc

Blacksmith
In both of my previous playthroughs, Lydia died within two missions of acquiring her as a housecarl. She sucked so bad I told her to stay in Whiterun on my current playthrough.
 

Thallik the Orc

Blacksmith
Her base health is the same as every other companion, but it almost seems like she has 50% less health than every other creature in Skyrim, not housecarl material at all if you ask me.
 

Falmer19

Active Member
hahahahahaha forum wars.
Farkas at level 50- Farkas - The Elder Scrolls Wiki

Lydia at level 50-http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Lydia
(all housecarls have the same stats).

Aela the Huntress- Aela the Huntress - The Elder Scrolls Wiki



Scroll down for the stats on the links. Housecarls win. They are more diverse (weapon wise), and aren't broken perk wise. Sorry, but i believe Dagmar wins. Your game must be screwed up, or she must have already been injured is she died at level 7.
 

samgurl775

Cerberus Officer
For those interested in a full follower stat spread sheet.
 

SilentCO1

New Member
She died for me all of my playthroughs too. I only find magic companions to be useful, especially arch-curate Vyrthur (as a thrall). They're the only ones that deal enough damage and don't constantly get in my way/block my shots.
 

Dagmar

Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
People who think the Housecarls aren't the best melee fighters among followers are simply ignorant about the mechanics of how followers are supposed to work, how they've been glitched since launch so they don't work that way, and how to fix them so that they approximate how they're supposed to work.

Followers will match your level the first time you enter their cell. Their cell is a predefined area where you first encounter them. This is working as intended. Since most players jump into the main questline their first time rather quickly that means that the first Housecarl they meet is Lydia, and like their character at the time, she is relatively low in level. Sometimes she'll actually be a higher level than players that dive right into the main questline because her minimum level is 6 so she may seem okay as a follower in the beginning. This is also true of Faendal and Sven since most players pass through Riverwood on the way to Whiterun when they pursue the main questline without delay.


Every time you dismiss a follower and leave their cell, the next time you reenter their cell, two things are supposed to happen: (1) their level is supposed to go up to your level or their level cap if it's lower than your level and (2) they are supposed to reset their statistics to reflect their increased level, going up proportionally towards what you see as their max stats on the follower chart found with the link that samgurl775 posted. This has been glitched since launch and as a result followers statistics never reset on their own (with one notable exception regarding Farkas during Proving Honor). Specifically, the followers level will go up (verifiable with the getlevel console command on the PC), but their stats don't update and go up accordingly (also verifiable with various console commands on the PC).

That means if you meet Lydia at Dragonskeep after completing Dragon Rising at level 6, her stats will remain at level 6 unless you proactively do something about it (see below). Since all followers can level up to at least 25, as you level, every follower you meet afterwards will have better primary stats and generally will perform better in combat then a "level 6" Lydia. This is why so many players think Lydia is inherently a bad follower while, for example, Mjoll, who they generally meet much later in the game at a much higher level, is superior melee fighter.

For anyone who likes to use followers and wants to see how they should be performing without the bugged leveling mechanics, i.e as they're supposed to perform, there is a way to proactively reset a follower's stats so that they update to their level. Get the Daedric Artifact Wabbajack. It's a relatively safe Daedric quest to do at any level so you can do it early in the game (plus it's a fun artifact to use). Travel to Solitude and look for a man outside the Bards College asking for someone to help his master. Speak with him to begin the quest. When you complete the quest you get the Wabbajack.

How to use the Wabbajack to level your follower:
1. Take your follower to an unpopulated area. This is so there are no witnesses for what comes next which might otherwise incur a bounty for assault.
2. Dismiss your follower.
3. Save your game (this is because you may end up killing your follower using this method of resetting followers).
4. Attack your follower with the Wabbajack until you either kill your follower or polymorph them into an animal. If you kill them reload the saved game and try again.
5. Once you polymorph them, punch them once and they will turn back into themselves. When they do this, they will reset and their stats will all level up to their current level.

If you do this, you should notice a difference in how followers that you met early in the game now perform. The earlier you met them in the game and the higher your level and their level cap is, the more pronounced and dramatic that difference will be. If you met any follower with a high level cap (40-50) when you were level 10 or less and you do this to them when you are level 40-50, the difference is like night and day.
 

Kalin of High Rock

Faal Lun Vahdin
My followers need to be made of sterner stuff. I usually travel alone, because I have a great love of explosive spells and little patience for people or horses that stand between myself and my opponents. I travel with Mjoll, if I travel with anyone at all. Which I usually don't, she's quite the chatterbox.


I was so pleased with Arvok, the summoned horse added with Dawnguard. A highly expendable summoned creature that can be replaced at the flick of a wrist if he runs afoul of my thunderbolts? Sign me up! No more doing silly things like "aiming" or "being careful" because Shadowmere or Frost are more eager to charge off into battle than even the most seasoned and skilled of followers. Stupid Horses. Stand out of the way and eat grass, I've got this.
 

Dagmar

Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
I have made this thread to prove to this person that housecarls aren't the best, and generally suck.
This proves absolutely nothing btw. It's a mere opinion poll. The follower stats dictate factually which followers function the best as melee fighters and they indicate that Housecarls have the best toolset for melee combat.
 
Also, you politely told me that I was ignorant for not knowing how to keep my followers at my own level, but I would like to point out, not only do I very well know about the wabbajack leveling glitch, but Lydia died on me literally a level after I got her, and before I even got wabbajack. I. Simply went into a burial place to explore, and like the third draugr I see kills her.

She had full steel equipped, which is the best armor I had at the time. Explain how I used her incorrectly.
 

Svarnor

Shadowcloak of Nocturnal
Woah dude... Your raging a little bit. I hate to ruin your hopes, but Dagmar's right here, and she's not accusing people of being on drugs, which doesn't really help your argument.
 
Woah dude... Your raging a little bit. I hate to ruin your hopes, but Dagmar's right here, and she's not accusing people of being on drugs, which doesn't really help your argument.

Yeah, I know. I'm just tired, and she has been calling me a dumb ass for literally a few days. If you go to the best follower thread you may notice that I even tried to end the conversation, cause I was sick of reading pages of her raging about my ignorance to skyrim followers.
It's very late where I am, so yeah.

Sorry about that dagmar.

And by the way svarnor, who gave you the right to decide who is right about this. That post wasn't to help my argument, it was just me raging. But yeah, you think housecarls a re the best tanks, but that doesn't mean that they are.
 
My followers need to be made of sterner stuff. I usually travel alone, because I have a great love of explosive spells and little patience for people or horses that stand between myself and my opponents. I travel with Mjoll, if I travel with anyone at all. Which I usually don't, she's quite the chatterbox.


I was so pleased with Arvok, the summoned horse added with Dawnguard. A highly expendable summoned creature that can be replaced at the flick of a wrist if he runs afoul of my thunderbolts? Sign me up! No more doing silly things like "aiming" or "being careful" because Shadowmere or Frost are more eager to charge off into battle than even the most seasoned and skilled of followers. Stupid Horses. Stand out of the way and eat grass, I've got this.

Lol, I agree, horses should know their place. However, shadow mere once simultaneously killed an elder and ancient dragon, which is a feat I have trouble doing on my master setting. That horse doesn't die easily. I just wish there was a more noble horse like him, since I play a paladin and it would look really weird riding in on an undead assassin horse, to save everyone from the undead.
 

Yukari Yakumo

The Countless Violet Clouds
My problem is the lack of jumping/falling ability.
Had the same beef in Fallout 3.
It's very tiresome to have to skirt around a block or two just so your follower doesn't take twenty minutes to find you or get themselves killed off on their own while you're waiting for them.
 
For dagmar:

Okay, I had decided to finally end this argument which me and dagmar have had for quite a feew days. First of all, I see no point in arguing with you, seeing how you don't listen to anything contradictory to your beliefs, instead viewing the thoughts of others as either misguided, ignorant, or simply incorrect. It is obvious that you are a very naive and closed minded person, who only sees the world as your way, or wrong. It just occurred to me that this whole talk is stupid, since different types of followers can suit different people, and their is no real best, only opinions. For example, the follower whom I think is the best would have to be erandur. I think this because his flame destruction and restoration compliments my own archetype greatly, and we are practically unstoppable in our deadly combo. It is obvious that Lydia and you work in a similar fashion, and I admit that I was wrong to say that Lydia is t the best match for you.

Now, although I have made amends with my wrongs during this arguments, you also have to appologize. You have excessively called me an imbecile on many threads, and concluded from this whole thing that I don't know how to use followers, I will admit, you did teach me that farkas is a plopsty tank, although I thought he would be a too one. I never used him, and I think most people can see why I would assume that a melée trained of heavy armor would make a decent tank, not thief.

Either way, I am tired of arguing over this, as I see that it is futile for many reasons. Combining your stubbornness, as well as my own, and the fact that we are arguing over opinions, it makes it impossible for this to go anywhere, but escalate until someone gets deeply offended. And seeing how I find I can easily offend people from past experience, I wish to end this before I seriously piss some people off.

Either way, I hope that you can make some kind of post to seal that this argument is over, hopefully not trolling about how I am an ignorant piece of crap who has no idea what skyrim is. Then I will close this thread, and we may let bygones be bygones.

Thank you for your cooperation.
 

Dagmar

Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
I have nothing to apologize about and calling me naive and close minded under the guise of pretending to be apologetic is transparently insincere. The conversation was never about what follower one finds most appealing or meshes best with. It was and has always been about which followers are the best melee fighters. Follower stats aren't just theoretical numbers. They have direct correlation to how well the follower does in using each skill the same as any NPC or player character. If they didn't there would be no reason for any of us to level skills or customize our character builds. It's simply hard fact that if a follower has the highest set of melee combat related skills in the game, they are going to be the best melee fighters. I'm sorry if you're incapable of absorbing that concept but I'm not sorry for calling you out when you make easily refutable assertions about followers anymore than I'd be sorry for calling out a Creationist claiming that evolution isn't science. This is a public forum. If you don't like having the credibility of your posts attacked and undermined then you're going to have to refrain from making incredulous statements. It's really that simple.

As I stated before, a level capped Housecarl is the best melee fighter follower in the game and can take on anything in the game using his or her skills if you know how to maximize their utility:




 

Hildolfr

It's a big hammer.
To be honest, the only reason I went with Mjoll and Vilkas is because Mjoll is immortal (I've never used Vilkas as a follower aside from Companion quests). As far as damage output and versatility, I know not.
 

Svarnor

Shadowcloak of Nocturnal
Sorry Speckled, I didn't mean your argument is invalid, just that her point about resetting follower's stats is correct. I apologize for not making that clear.
 

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