OOC (18+) Dirty Coin

[Specter of Death]

Forgot to mention, the hoods, are according to the Image. Hope you Like!!!

 

[AS88]

I'm pretty diappointed that you've taken over the Reach, taken the most influential source of wealth in Markarth and destroyed the Forsworn.

I've also got no idea how Tarik has ex-Legion Werewolves and Vampires working together to protect a town, when everything we've ever seen about Werewolves and Vampires is that they hate each other and have an inevitable hunger for humans. I think the whole thing is pretty OP, there's no grounding in terms of economics to pay all these creatures and the thing with the Reach takes the biscuit.

I'm feeling like Valin's and Specter's characters are both still quite OP.

 

[Ponder]

Specter, factors as large as those in the Reach should really be discussed with AS88 beforehand, him being in control of that territory and whatnot.

Also, I've got to agree with AS88 and Majir-Dar on your character. However, I don't think being overpowered is the specific issue; rather, the issue stems from his excessive strength making him kind of boring in a way. Remember, we're writing, not playing a video game. While Tarik would be loads of fun to play in Skyrim, his lack of true weaknesses and, quite frankly, his lack of human depth, simplify the character to appear as little more than a killing machine. Furthermore, his primary trait is lore-breaking, and seems to serve no real purpose save to sound cool and make him even stronger.

Don't get me wrong--I'm all for creative license, and I think you're off to a great start. I just recommend toning Tarik down, so to speak, and bringing out his humanity.

 

[AS88]

Specter, factors as large as those in the Reach should really be discussed with AS88 beforehand, him being in control of that territory and whatnot.

Also, I've got to agree with AS88 and Majir-Dar on your character. However, I don't think being overpowered is the specific issue; rather, the issue stems from his excessive strength making him kind of boring in a way. Remember, we're writing, not playing a video game. While Tarik would be loads of fun to play in Skyrim, his lack of true weaknesses and, quite frankly, his lack of human depth, simplify the character to appear as little more than a killing machine. Furthermore, his primary trait is lore-breaking, and seems to serve no real purpose save to sound cool and make him even stronger.

Don't get me wrong--I'm all for creative license, and I think you're off to a great start. I just recommend toning Tarik down, so to speak, and bringing out his humanity.

Agreed.

When I'm writing a CC, I always look at the thread starter's character for reference on the type of character and how far to go with their power. If you look at Phantom's, he makes a point of stating that he has very little real combat skill, and goes on to describe his economic style of leadership, with those underneath him doing a lot of the work in a shady way, under the radar. Valin's and Specter's go against the under the radar theme, and both have a lot of combat skill. There's no reason why they wouldn't be decent in combat, but the massive clout they then have with all of their powerful underlings sounds more like a small private army than a criminal organisation with a basis in one hold of one province. By 'criminal', that provides that they are avoiding the law, not actively choosing what goes on with their own guards patrolling the hold.

I'm not trying to offend anyone, but this is a lot easier to do well before the RP starts, rather than complaining halfway through.

 

[The Phantom]

Indeed. I'm sorry Specter, but in its current state I can by no means accept your application. Don't get me wrong, your literary techniques and abilities are remarkably credible, however you are breaking the lore in more ways than just the hybrid. As AS88 described it, "I've also got no idea how Tarik has ex-Legion Werewolves and Vampires working together to protect a town, when everything we've ever seen about Werewolves and Vampires is that they hate each other and have an inevitable hunger for humans." Also, why are only vampires and lycans trusted by him?

Next, I also agree with Ponder's point that due to your character's seemingly god-like characteristics, he is rather boring and lacks depth. One reason why I made this thread and gave Arthrago little fighting capability was to focus on personality and character development in order for our characters to be interesting. I really hope that I'm not coming across as rude but I would like you to revise your application. I feel that if you focused more on secrecy, personality and development then your Empire and Character would be brilliant. Also, take heed of all of AS88 and Ponder's points while revising your character as they are all completely valid. This same principal applies to Valin. My apologies, I really would prefer to compliment and not criticise, but your writing abilities are good and if I did not feel that your application could be brilliant then I would not give you two a second chance.

 

[Valin Oakthorn]

I'm confused. My CC states that Joseph has next to no fighting skill with weapons, and is only effective when he gets a surprise attack at close enough range to bite someone. Also, his only fear is death. I don't know, but I'm pretty sure that someone with low fighting ability who is scared of death is no way a warrior. If I take away his ability to bite and scratch than that breaks lore, because every vampire ever can bite and scratch and has a drive to do it for feeding.

I also don't see a problem with vampires and werewolves working along side each other. A lot of times people like to write that their character hates the other species because that's what is going on in a lot of non elders crolls games. There's no definitive reason (As far as I know.) that says that vampires and werewolves absolutely must hate each other, especially if there is a new Hyrbrid species that is providing leadership and bringing them together impartially.

 

[The Phantom]

Valin, your CC and EC was accepted but I was merely stating that you may wish to look back and revise your character. One thing I planned on mentioning, was that the Tsaesci invasion was not a reference to the vampiric serpentine people but the Akaviri people who lived in the same region who would later go on to become the Blades and subsequently killed off (in Akavir) in an act of mass genocide by their serpent-people neighbours who proceeded to take the mantle of Tsaesci. But I'm not asking you to change any of that. Joseph Black Briar is fine in the thread as long as we proceed to develop him further during the course of the thread, fret not.

 

[AS88]

I also don't see a problem with vampires and werewolves working along side each other. A lot of times people like to write that their character hates the other species because that's what is going on in a lot of non elders crolls games. There's no definitive reason (As far as I know.) that says that vampires and werewolves absolutely must hate each other, especially if there is a new Hyrbrid species that is providing leadership and bringing them together impartially.

"Yes, I can smell it on you. The power of my blood will purge that filth and make you whole again."
Lord Harkon
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Lord_Harkon

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:World_Interactions#Werewolves_VS_Vampires

The game makes it clear twice that werewolves and vampires don't get on, just sayin'.

 

[Valin Oakthorn]

I don't see how that's proof that all vampires and all werewolves don't get along. It is completely possible that certain vampires and certain werewolves hate the other, but that's like saying that because a couple of Nords in windhelm completely despise Dark elves that all nords despise dark elves.

I do however see your point, and the others agree so I'm cool with whatever the decision. Majority rules.

 

[Valin Oakthorn]

Valin, your CC and EC was accepted but I was merely stating that you may wish to look back and revise your character. One thing I planned on mentioning, was that the Tsaesci invasion was not a reference to the vampiric serpentine people but the Akaviri people who lived in the same region who would later go on to become the Blades and subsequently killed off (in Akavir) in an act of mass genocide by their serpent-people neighbours who proceeded to take the mantle of Tsaesci. But I'm not asking you to change any of that. Joseph Black Briar is fine in the thread as long as we proceed to develop him further during the course of the thread, fret not.

Hmm, I never noticed that in the Times I read through that lore. Thanks for the information.

 

[Specter of Death]

When I I used purple, I meant only minor influence. Meaning we have some guards. And I didn't even think about the vampire were Wolf thing. I will remove vampires from my list. But, the purple, doesn't mean taken over, it simply means that we have maybe 2 guards in that hold who are loyal to is, and are guarding prisons.

Via Samsung GS4

 

[Majir-Dar]

Picture not made by me, all credit goes to: severeene at DeviantArt​

​

BASIC
Name: Thorek Ocean-Strider
Alias: Fenrir Kin-Slayer
Empire Name: The Dead Brethren
Empire's Base Hold: Eastmarch
Currently Resides: A modified Hjerim that has been enlarged to include the House of Clan Shatter-Shield in Windhelm
Age: 41
Date of Birth: 4E 160
Race: Nord
Birth Place: Windhelm, Skyrim
Origin: A Nord mother: Jensine Ocean-Strider. A Nord father: Thorygg Ocean-Strider.
Gender: Male
Laterality: Right Handed
Sexuality: Heterosexual
Marital Status: Married
Health: Healthy
Affiliations: Corrupted business men and politicians across the provinces, Brunwolf Free-Winter
Religion: Atheist (pretends to worship the Nine)
Occupation: Mastermind of the Dead Brethren and president of the Maritime Trade Federation
APPEARANCE
Hair: Shoulder-Length Blonde hair with a knotted beard
Eye Color: Deep Blue
Build: Muscular
Height: 6'4”
Weight: 196 lb
Skin: Tan
Scars: A large scar across his forearm, two on his back, and one diagonal scar on his chest
PERSONALITY
Positive Traits: Loyal, Honors his Word, Ambitious, Decisive, Devoted, Tolerant, Punctual, Reliable, Professional
Negative Traits: Quick to Anger, Vindictive, Unforgiving, Often Unsettling, Insensitive, His emotions sometimes get the better of him
Likes: Wealth, Family, Law (more specifically his law), Sailing, Fine Alcohols and Foods, Professionalism
Dislikes: Traitors, Bigots, Fools, Unfaithful Spouses, Cowards, Impolite People, Insubordination
Fears: Storm Atronachs, Draugr, Skeletons
Aspirations: To gain control of Windhelm and eventually become High King of Skyrim, help the Maritime Trade Federation surpass the East Empire Company, and keep the Dead Brethren an active force
COMBAT SKILLS
Major: Duel-Wielding War Axes, Light Armor
Minor: Hand-to-Hand, Blocking
GEAR
Amour: Chainmail with steel bracers and a green habit
Weapons: Dulled steel war axes to inflict pain but not kill
Clothes: Radiant Raiment fine clothes and fine boots
Other: He wears his gold wedding band at all times
HISTORY


Childhood/Teenage Years: Thorek Ocean-Strider's father was a sailor for the Imperial Navy and, as such, was away from home for years at a time. Thorek remembers little of his father during his childhood, he mostly knew only what his mother was willing to tell him. She didn't like talking about Thorek's father, at the time he didn't know why, it was only later did he realize she simply didn't like reliving the memories that talking about his father would bring up. They would simply remind her that he wasn't around and may not come back.

His mother, Jensine Ocean-Strider, was a farmhand, and tried to be home as much as possible to try and properly raise her child but there is only so much one could do. Not that Thorek was a bad child, but it was difficult to control him at times due to being away for most of the day.

Thorek's father, Thorygg Ocean-Strider, returned home early in Thorek's teenage years. His father was discharged due to a useless left leg. It had been paralyzed when boarding an enemy ship, that's all Thorek was ever told or wanted to know. Being discharged in what he considered to be such a dishonorable way sent Thorygg into a depression and he took to skooma and alcohol to try, without much success, to lift himself from this depression. When he drank Thorygg only go angered and beat his wife, child, or often both of them; when he consumed skooma he was too high to do or care about anything, and when he wasn't drunk or high he did whatever he could to be.

This traumatized Thorek. He was too afraid to run to the guards or properly defend himself or his mother from the drunken onslaught of his father, and his mother was convinced he still loved and cherished her and would get a job any day. But, like many sad stories, Thorygg got too drunk, beat his wife just a little too hard, and she died in front of Thorek as he walked in the front door to their house. The enraged Thorek grabbed a nearby kitchen knife and stabbed his surprised father twelve times in the chest.

The guards came in shortly afterward to take Thorek away from his dead parents and assess the situation. They saw the empty mead bottles, the bruises on Jensine, and quickly realized what had happened. Thorek was to be sent to Honorhall in Riften, the nearest orphanage. When he returned the property of his parents would be given to him.

Adulthood: The return to Windhelm from the orphanage was strange for the older Thorek Ocean-Glider. There seemed to be more of everything, more Dunmer, more racists, and more buildings, but his old house had stayed the same (minus the blood splatter and such from the violent beating of his mother and the bleeding of his father). When he walked in he noticed how clean and fresh everything looked, the woman cleaning it said the Jarl had asked her to and it would be free of charge. Her money came from the Jarl. The Jarl at this time was Ulfric Stormcloak.

However, the house didn't stay in Thorek's possession for long, he soon sold it and used the money to buy a decent ship and a hardened crew. At first, the money flowed in nicely, but the East Empire Company soon stole whatever business he was getting. Thorek, not one to be crossed, got a mask, a dark robe, and ordered his crew to do the same. Under the cloak of the night's new moon they planned to attack an East Empire Company ship for its cargo and take it as their own. The battle raged for a few hours, the Company being stronger than they had initially suspected. Thorek's crew suffered heavy causalities but they succeeded in taking the ship. They took the cargo and sailed back for Windhelm. When they got home they claimed they were attacked by pirates but they managed to fend them off.

They sold the cargo (mostly fine cloths) to some merchants in High Rock and made off like bandits. They soon found that with Skyrim's Civil War defenses fell not only on land but even more so out on the ocean. Pirating was a lucrative business that treated Thorek Ocean-Strider well. Realizing the importance of not being caught, he took the alias Fenrir Kin-Slayer to help not only hide his true identity, but to intimidate future and present opponents as well. He did all pirating and illegal activities in disguise and ordered his crew to do the same.

In the middle of the chaos of Thorek's life, he got married to Malene, a Nord that had helped him with some of his less reputable deals. She was his second in command before she was his wife. The wedding itself wasn't anything special but they honeymooned in Senchal, Elsweyr for two weeks before coming back to Windhelm.

After years of pirating, Thorek Ocean-Strider had collecting enough money to buy a decent home, expand the docks, and had even driven the Shatter-Shields from their usual oceanic trade affairs. He took the Shatter-Shield office and renamed it the Maritime Trade Federation. It promised ship captains safe travel, a plentiful crew, job security, and, most importantly, gold. It gave them freedom to trade what they want, and where they want to sell it as long as it was beneficial to the Federation. In a few more years, Thorek took the Shatter-Shield property and merged it with his own to enlarge his house.

Thorek kept to his illegal affairs even though he could probably live the rest of his life wealthy. It gave him power over trade and, as such, gave him power in Windhelm, the second most important city in Skyrim, but he never went back on another pirating voyage, he left that to his fleet. He had hoped he would be crowned Jarl when Ulfric Stormcloak was killed but instead Brunwolf Free-Winter was given the privilege. Still, Thorek is the next best thing, he's personal friends with the Jarl.

EMPIRE
Crime Lord: Thorek Ocean-Strider (Fenrir Kin-Slayer)
Empire Name: The Dead Brethren
Base Hold: Eastmarch
Base of Operations: Maritime Trade Federation Office located in the docks of Windhelm (where Clan Shatter-Shield's office used to be)
Honest Means of Wealth: Thorek Ocean-Strider is the president of his newly formed Maritime Trade Federation. He manages the ships that get sent out, what they carry, and where they go. However, there are also ship captains not directly under his control but still apart of the Federation. He still gets a cut of the wealth in exchange for the protection and job security he provides. Thorek Ocean-Strider is not alone in managing the Maritime Trade Federation, he has advisers formed of willing and powerful fleet captains such as himself that hold almost as much power as him. Exact numbers vary depending on what cargo he carries, how many ships he has at the moment, and how long it will take for the ship to make it to the destination and back. Along with the Maritime Trade Federation, Thorek owns two carriages that he uses to send honest cargo to and from Riften, Dawnstar, and Whiterun.
Maritime Trade Federation Flag:

​

Pirate Flag:

Dishonest Means of Wealth: Although the Federation is a great way for Thorek to maintain a positive public face and get some money in the process, it's also a front for his more discreet actions. Most of which involve pirating and selling drugs to other provinces. All he has to do is change some documents, send out a trusted ship, and send more to guard the ship. He owns two ships and two carriages that he trusts with escorting illegal cargo to other provinces and holds.
Source of Honest and Dishonest Cargo: Thorek receives most of his cargo from pirating to raise profit, specifically targeting the East Empire Company when possible. He keeps the weapons for his own forces, keeps most of the alcohol for his crews, but almost everything else sells. He has also been known to get things for people that order, and to sell less than reputable goods for crime lords.
Security: Each ship is equipped with fifteen powerful guards. Each carry crossbows with explosive bolts to destroy ships, carry a steel sword, wear steel armor, and have a steel shield. Those that don't have a crossbow know fire destruction magic. His pirate ships have twenty-five powerful guards carrying similar equipment.
Empire Rules:
1. No one but Fenrir Kin-Slayer can present himself directly to another of our allies.
2. Never look at the wives of friends.
3. Never be seen with guards.
4. Always being available for the Dead Brethren is a duty - even if your wife's about to give birth.
5. Appointments must always be respected.
6. Wives must be treated with respect.
7. When asked for any information, the answer must be the truth.
8. Money cannot be appropriated if it belongs to friends or allies.
9. Never betray the Dead Brethren or its allies.
10. People who can't be part of the Dead Brethren: anyone who has a close relative among the guards, anyone with a traitor relative in the family, anyone who behaves terribly.
11. Always obey a direct order given from a superior Brethren.
12. Always wear your uniform when conducting Dead Brethren business on any level.
13. Never drink alcohol while conducting Dead Brethren business on any level.
14. Never consume skooma.
15. The only Brethren allowed to consume moon sugar: Khajiiti.

 

[Majir-Dar]

If something needs to be clarified or revised, simply let me know and I'll get on it as soon as possible.

 

[AS88]

If something needs to be clarified or revised, simply let me know and I'll get on it as soon as possible.

Dude needs to be heavier, or shorter. I'm 6'2" and 175lbs, heavier than your 6'9" Nord.

Other than that, I like it a lot. Jealous.

 

[Specter of Death]

OK CLARIFICATION TIME!!!!!!!!​

​

I'm never one to push buttons, or cause trouble, and I hate making people upset or irritated, because it causes un neccessary arguments. I read all of your comments, and Now I am going to clarify EVERYTHING that you guys mentioned.

Clarifications: On the Map that I have provided to You, I had taken into account that You all had major control over every other hold minus Falkreath. Which Is why I put Falkreath Hold in Red. Now, where I placed the prisons, shouldn't be a problem, but AS88 and Phantom, you guys had a problem that I was taking over most of the reach. I colored a small area around my Prison with Purple, and on the Key, it says 'Minor Pack Influence'. Meaning My empire has 2-3 Loyal/Paid Off guards or Spys or People in that area. Usually they are guarding the Prisons, or watching for smuggling problems. AS88, you also stated you were disapointed that the Forsworn were gone. I assumed that by now the Events in The Forsworn Conspiracy, have already taken place. I was just assuming that Markarth's forces ended as much of them as they could. Not saying they were all dead, I only said that Madanoch was Dead. And AS88 also said that I have Taken over most influential source of wealth. Not at all. I complete smuggles through that prison, and any prisoners, that My Empire imprisons there, we get the whole 70% and 30% and all recources from Said prisoners. Not all of them. Now the Vampire and Werewolves thing, it will be revised, to an extent. As Valin stated, you cannot just assume that all vampires and werewolves are enemies, because a few are enemies.

What I will Change: Tarik's CC - You said he was to 'God Like' and 'Over Powered'. I am not seeing how the whole hybrid thing or his fighting skills take into that. But I do see what you mean when you say he lacks depth. So heres what I will revise there, reather than him being 'intelligent' and 'diplomatic' I will make him Short Thinking and Rather Impatient, ill manored, bad tempered, and just an Angry Guy. That way the things he lacks, he can slightly gain from the help of his Wardens, but the fact that he is the leader, won't allow them to have any full control, still making him weak in that manor. I will also change The Werewolf Vampire thing. There will be mostly werewolves, do to the extent that they are imprisoned or killed, so it gives Tarik a means of Guard. Let's say when he catches a werewolf with a bounty, he gets the bounty and offers him freedom after a certain time is served, and they help him out? Now vampires can be similar, but one might argue that less vampires get arrested. So if they do, it is the same process. That will make the guards more werewolf than vampire. Now the whole hybrid thing. I had already discussed this with majir. The only thing he really gains from being a Hybrid, is the ability to walk in the daylight as a vampire, and turning into a wolf. He looses all fancy abilities such as strength and speed, any howls or abilities such as Vampires Kiss. Weakness wise, I'd say fire still has an effect, but not as much as before, and rather than having the choice to turn, he must turn at least once a week. And if he doesn't feed once a day, he can go into bloodlust, which in his case, is an uncontrolable feeding frenzy. And that risks the chance of loosing loyalties.

I hope this helps in the slightest. Anything else I missed, just tell me, and I will change or update. No offense taken by any of you by the way. May sound like an excuse, but I was extremely stressed and tired writing that all yesterday, and I realize he may have come acrossed OP or Goddy. I apologize on that front.

 

[Majir-Dar]

If something needs to be clarified or revised, simply let me know and I'll get on it as soon as possible.

Dude needs to be heavier, or shorter. I'm 6'2" and 175lbs, heavier than your 6'9" Nord.

Other than that, I like it a lot. Jealous.

Thanks, I always have a hard time with weight to height ratios. I'll put him at 201 lbs.

 

[Valin Oakthorn]

Lol. I'm 5"11 and I weigh more than the original him.

Also Phantom, I took another look at my character and am not that happy with him. Would it be possible that I could rewrite my CC and EC to have a different character/setup. If you aren't happy with the new one I can always go back to the current one.

 

[AS88]

If something needs to be clarified or revised, simply let me know and I'll get on it as soon as possible.

Dude needs to be heavier, or shorter. I'm 6'2" and 175lbs, heavier than your 6'9" Nord.

Other than that, I like it a lot. Jealous.

Thanks, I always have a hard time with weight to height ratios. I'll put him at 201 lbs.

Unless you want him to be very tall, could I make a suggestion and say 6'4" and 196lbs?

Specter of Death, I appreciate your post clarifying stuff, but I'm still not convinced on the vampires and werewolves. You could maybe have a couple of each in your network, but I think having more than that takes away from the RP, as Phantom has said a few times already. Also, thanks for drawing my attention to the map, I'd not seen it, but a) I don't want you to own Cidhna Mine (it's going to be a vital part of my Empire Card and my character's relationship with his hold), and b) I don't want you to have any more than one or two (human) Markarth Guards helping you out with intelligence. Nobody else has influential intelligence in other holds, so it stands to reason that you shouldn't either. But again, having one or two wanderers could be expected.

I could see your character being really cool if you worked on him. You could have him the head of a small group of men (which may contain one or two werewolves), who don't actually have a lot of influence in reality, but use scare tactics and threats (possibly in the form of killed livestock or other savagery) to deal with law-abiding people in your way.

I took another look at my character and am not that happy with him. Would it be possible that I could rewrite my CC and EC to have a different character/setup. If you aren't happy with the new one I can always go back to the current one.

I think that's a good idea. It's always tough to edit a character who you've created in a certain image. It might be better for you to think about the way the RP will work in terms of under the radar dealings and quiet influence and create a character in that mould.

 

[Specter of Death]

I am probably just going to pull out of this RP. Mainly because I thought I could keep up with everything as is, but I can't. I honestly have more crap on my plate than I could've expected. Though I am excited to join this, and willing to change it, with all of my commissions half done, and my other RP's falling at the short side, I don't think I can even keep up with updates. I have to get stuff done today, that I wouldn't even touch if I kept updating or revising this CC and EC. I thought It was fun writing with it, and maybe another time. Sorry to drop out at last moment, EVERYONE, but I will read this thread every post. Thanks!

 

[Valin Oakthorn]

Ok. Bye Bye Specter, best of luck to you.